DomovEnglish3rd half The real top 10 guilds (fans are worthless ;) )

The real top 10 guilds (fans are worthless ;) )
06/01/17 09:39
Black Monks :

Reading some of the forums and seeing some of the top guilds wanting to drop out of the top so their guild could have the most fans made me think of a new system that I feel is far more accurate and hopefully will encourage some teams to try to move up the rankings so we have the best vs the best instead of most of the best only. So I took each team in the top 100 and assigned 1 point for the guild for the #100 ranked player, 51 points for the #50 player and 100 points for the number 1 player. In other words the top 100 get points inverse to their player ranking out of the top 100. Let me know your thoughts and below is the first top 10:

1. International lions (combined retired and not retired hoping the retired return). 662 points
2. Lomus legends. 482 points
3. Arena of Champions. 424 points
4. Terra Nova. 292 points
5. Demi mail. 234 points
6. Fb banter. 232 points
7. Scrum down ruck over drink up. 199 points
8. Flying fijians. 140 points
9. French flair. 114 points
10. 140k+. 88 points

Minimum 3 teams in top 100 and data collected on 1/4/2017 @ 1000 CST (CENTRAL TIME IN THE US)


This is a nice idea but it does not work. The current system of fans does work as the whole guild contributes to where that guild is in the overall standings. Your method only takes into account those in the guild that are in the top 100. The guild you have as top currently has a player that is ranked 31’000 with only 28’000 fans! Hardly worthy of a top slot.

A better way of doing it would be to add up the ranking of everyone in the guild. The guild with the lowest total score is then top, the rest cascade down. This way the whole guild contributes to the guild ranking rather than just the top few.

I guess there is always the risk that the alliances will swap all their best player to one guild but this is easily fixed. You just implement a rule that you can only move in and out of the same guild twice.
Posted on 06/01/17 09:39.
06/01/17 10:37
Are you M-Dots latest mouthpiece? Sure I've seen this somewhere else...hmm...

Anyway, you are clutching at straws based on one guy that has joined us because we had space and he thought he could pick up some tips. Well done on identifying a way that competely ignores the overall strength of the overall guild. It's clear you've suggested this as a way to try to undermine the-guild-that-must-not-be-named. Your idea looks reasonable on the surface but just doesn't stand up to scrutiny. What this demonstrates is that there is a flaw in every argument. There will be something that doesn't suit everyone.

At the end of the day, Black Monks has just come up with an alternative way of doing ranking. Nothing stopping you from expanding it to include whatever number would suit you and your guild best. Best get counting eh?
Posted on 06/01/17 10:37.
06/01/17 11:17
Nope, same guild, the offical top guild A simple IP address check will prove I'm not M-dot . Its not for me to count but i would still say that the overall rank of a guild should be the accumulaion of all guild members and not just the top few. Struggling to see why anyone would disagree with that. Individual rankings cover individuals, guild rankings cover the whole guild. My method does show the overall strengh of the guild, that is the very point of it. Overall strengh not individual strengths!
Posted on 06/01/17 11:17.
06/01/17 12:16
Didn't say you were M-Dot...read it carefully. Just the post is an exact replica of what has been posted elsewhere...
Not overly disagreeing really...what's to stop someone highly ranked to just be in a guild on their own? As long as they were in top 25 then they would be above any guild that had 25 members. Extreme example I agree but as I said, there are flaws in all systems. At least fan base is objective!

Congratulations on being official top guild...not an easy achievement with the fan losses coming back in.
Posted on 06/01/17 12:16.
06/01/17 12:50
Chepstow Harlequins :

Didn't say you were M-Dot...read it carefully. Just the post is an exact replica of what has been posted elsewhere...
Not overly disagreeing really...what's to stop someone highly ranked to just be in a guild on their own? As long as they were in top 25 then they would be above any guild that had 25 members. Extreme example I agree but as I said, there are flaws in all systems. At least fan base is objective!

Congratulations on being official top guild...not an easy achievement with the fan losses coming back in.


Good point didnt think of that, i guess it needs to be a combibation of both fans and rankings then? Which is far too complicated to work out so will likely remain as just fans, which is fine, its shows commitment at least.

CT has purposely sacificed individual rank for the guild ranks. Most of the top players that could be in the top 100 are sitting around 100 to 300 to preserve fans. Some are much higher even though they could challenge for the top 20. To be honest we are happy being out of the current melee.
Posted on 06/01/17 12:50.
06/01/17 13:04
Jelly Bean :

Black Monks :

Reading some of the forums and seeing some of the top guilds wanting to drop out of the top so their guild could have the most fans made me think of a new system that I feel is far more accurate and hopefully will encourage some teams to try to move up the rankings so we have the best vs the best instead of most of the best only. So I took each team in the top 100 and assigned 1 point for the guild for the #100 ranked player, 51 points for the #50 player and 100 points for the number 1 player. In other words the top 100 get points inverse to their player ranking out of the top 100. Let me know your thoughts and below is the first top 10:

1. International lions (combined retired and not retired hoping the retired return). 662 points
2. Lomus legends. 482 points
3. Arena of Champions. 424 points
4. Terra Nova. 292 points
5. Demi mail. 234 points
6. Fb banter. 232 points
7. Scrum down ruck over drink up. 199 points
8. Flying fijians. 140 points
9. French flair. 114 points
10. 140k+. 88 points

Minimum 3 teams in top 100 and data collected on 1/4/2017 @ 1000 CST (CENTRAL TIME IN THE US)


This is a nice idea but it does not work. The current system of fans does work as the whole guild contributes to where that guild is in the overall standings. Your method only takes into account those in the guild that are in the top 100. The guild you have as top currently has a player that is ranked 31’000 with only 28’000 fans! Hardly worthy of a top slot.

A better way of doing it would be to add up the ranking of everyone in the guild. The guild with the lowest total score is then top, the rest cascade down. This way the whole guild contributes to the guild ranking rather than just the top few.

I guess there is always the risk that the alliances will swap all their best player to one guild but this is easily fixed. You just implement a rule that you can only move in and out of the same guild twice.

Read my post please, fans don't matter, never have never will. If you think fans matter so you drop down to rank 5000 so you won't be challenged I say you aren't good enough to be considered top. Top players stay at high rankings and keep sufficient fans. We play the game to be best. I don't see how fans play into that. If you would like to have rankings that include fans please do so. If your guild doesn't care about rankings then don't worry about my real top 10. If you see flaws in the real top 10 other than fans then I am eager to hear them. Fans don't matter. If you want to go through every player of every guild feel free. I will stick to the top 100 as in my opinion there is no difference for a top player at 500 vs 15000000, they are the same for a champ 34, dodging competition.
Post edited by Black Monks on 06/01/17 13:08
06/01/17 13:11
Jelly Bean :

Chepstow Harlequins :

Didn't say you were M-Dot...read it carefully. Just the post is an exact replica of what has been posted elsewhere...
Not overly disagreeing really...what's to stop someone highly ranked to just be in a guild on their own? As long as they were in top 25 then they would be above any guild that had 25 members. Extreme example I agree but as I said, there are flaws in all systems. At least fan base is objective!

Congratulations on being official top guild...not an easy achievement with the fan losses coming back in.


Good point didnt think of that, i guess it needs to be a combibation of both fans and rankings then? Which is far too complicated to work out so will likely remain as just fans, which is fine, its shows commitment at least.

CT has purposely sacificed individual rank for the guild ranks. Most of the top players that could be in the top 100 are sitting around 100 to 300 to preserve fans. Some are much higher even though they could challenge for the top 20. To be honest we are happy being out of the current melee.

The whole point of my rankings is to encourage people to man up and prove they can be where they say they can be. Nobody looks at the top guilds fan page, there are other forums that show that clearly. If you do care about the top fans guilds then look at the gamesranking, if you care about the real top guilds then look at this, if you want to create your own hybrid then do it, if you want to c9mplain because your guild isn't here then actually try to show you are a top player and get to the top, if you have an improvement to my ranking that ignores fans I would love to hear it.
Posted on 06/01/17 13:11.
06/01/17 14:30
Black Monks :

Jelly Bean :

Chepstow Harlequins :

Didn't say you were M-Dot...read it carefully. Just the post is an exact replica of what has been posted elsewhere...
Not overly disagreeing really...what's to stop someone highly ranked to just be in a guild on their own? As long as they were in top 25 then they would be above any guild that had 25 members. Extreme example I agree but as I said, there are flaws in all systems. At least fan base is objective!

Congratulations on being official top guild...not an easy achievement with the fan losses coming back in.


Good point didnt think of that, i guess it needs to be a combibation of both fans and rankings then? Which is far too complicated to work out so will likely remain as just fans, which is fine, its shows commitment at least.

CT has purposely sacificed individual rank for the guild ranks. Most of the top players that could be in the top 100 are sitting around 100 to 300 to preserve fans. Some are much higher even though they could challenge for the top 20. To be honest we are happy being out of the current melee.

The whole point of my rankings is to encourage people to man up and prove they can be where they say they can be. Nobody looks at the top guilds fan page, there are other forums that show that clearly. If you do care about the top fans guilds then look at the gamesranking, if you care about the real top guilds then look at this, if you want to create your own hybrid then do it, if you want to c9mplain because your guild isn't here then actually try to show you are a top player and get to the top, if you have an improvement to my ranking that ignores fans I would love to hear it.


Your system is flawed as it does not incude every guild member, only those in the top 100. The top guild should be an accumulation of the skill of everyone in your guild, not just those in the top 100. We alreadly have an individual ranking system for that. In your system someone ranked 101 gets nothing, they are the same as someone ranked 800'000!!! You could have a guild with every member ranked between 101 and 200 and they would not feature in your rankings. You could then have a player ranked 30'000 with 27'000 fans and be in one of the top guilds!!!

There are plenty of other guilds that want to know where they are placed, its not all about the top 10. It was a nice try but currently the only way to measure the ranking of an entire guild is on fans.

For me a top player is one that can hold a high rank and keep max fans. Winning matches is one thing, defending them is more skillful as generally you won't be online when challenged and wont be able to use your subs. Therefore fans are important, they show defensive skill, if you keep losing them then you are not as good as you think.
Posted on 06/01/17 14:30.
06/01/17 14:39
Jelly Bean :

Black Monks :

Jelly Bean :

Chepstow Harlequins :

Didn't say you were M-Dot...read it carefully. Just the post is an exact replica of what has been posted elsewhere...
Not overly disagreeing really...what's to stop someone highly ranked to just be in a guild on their own? As long as they were in top 25 then they would be above any guild that had 25 members. Extreme example I agree but as I said, there are flaws in all systems. At least fan base is objective!

Congratulations on being official top guild...not an easy achievement with the fan losses coming back in.


Good point didnt think of that, i guess it needs to be a combibation of both fans and rankings then? Which is far too complicated to work out so will likely remain as just fans, which is fine, its shows commitment at least.

CT has purposely sacificed individual rank for the guild ranks. Most of the top players that could be in the top 100 are sitting around 100 to 300 to preserve fans. Some are much higher even though they could challenge for the top 20. To be honest we are happy being out of the current melee.

The whole point of my rankings is to encourage people to man up and prove they can be where they say they can be. Nobody looks at the top guilds fan page, there are other forums that show that clearly. If you do care about the top fans guilds then look at the gamesranking, if you care about the real top guilds then look at this, if you want to create your own hybrid then do it, if you want to c9mplain because your guild isn't here then actually try to show you are a top player and get to the top, if you have an improvement to my ranking that ignores fans I would love to hear it.


Your system is flawed as it does not incude every guild member, only those in the top 100. The top guild should be an accumulation of the skill of everyone in your guild, not just those in the top 100. We alreadly have an individual ranking system for that. In your system someone ranked 101 gets nothing, they are the same as someone ranked 800'000!!! You could have a guild with every member ranked between 101 and 200 and they would not feature in your rankings. You could then have a player ranked 30'000 with 27'000 fans and be in one of the top guilds!!!

There are plenty of other guilds that want to know where they are placed, its not all about the top 10. It was a nice try but currently the only way to measure the ranking of an entire guild is on fans.

For me a top player is one that can hold a high rank and keep max fans. Winning matches is one thing, defending them is more skillful as generally you won't be online when challenged and wont be able to use your subs. Therefore fans are important, they show defensive skill, if you keep losing them then you are not as good as you think.

Then you take the time to do it. And shut up with the fans. You like fans, it's a nice excuse for you to not try to show your quality. And let me correct what I said when asking for feedback earlier, I want both sides of feedback: problem and proposed solution. This should be tough, this should make people want to be in the top 100, what you say are flaws most see as strengths. Enjoy your fans and not testing yourself. Keeping fans is simple and there is no challenge to it, anyone can do it. Being ranked as high as you can be, there is the challenge
Posted on 06/01/17 14:39.
06/01/17 14:55
Black Monks :

Jelly Bean :

Black Monks :

Jelly Bean :

Chepstow Harlequins :

Didn't say you were M-Dot...read it carefully. Just the post is an exact replica of what has been posted elsewhere...
Not overly disagreeing really...what's to stop someone highly ranked to just be in a guild on their own? As long as they were in top 25 then they would be above any guild that had 25 members. Extreme example I agree but as I said, there are flaws in all systems. At least fan base is objective!

Congratulations on being official top guild...not an easy achievement with the fan losses coming back in.


Good point didnt think of that, i guess it needs to be a combibation of both fans and rankings then? Which is far too complicated to work out so will likely remain as just fans, which is fine, its shows commitment at least.

CT has purposely sacificed individual rank for the guild ranks. Most of the top players that could be in the top 100 are sitting around 100 to 300 to preserve fans. Some are much higher even though they could challenge for the top 20. To be honest we are happy being out of the current melee.

The whole point of my rankings is to encourage people to man up and prove they can be where they say they can be. Nobody looks at the top guilds fan page, there are other forums that show that clearly. If you do care about the top fans guilds then look at the gamesranking, if you care about the real top guilds then look at this, if you want to create your own hybrid then do it, if you want to c9mplain because your guild isn't here then actually try to show you are a top player and get to the top, if you have an improvement to my ranking that ignores fans I would love to hear it.


Your system is flawed as it does not incude every guild member, only those in the top 100. The top guild should be an accumulation of the skill of everyone in your guild, not just those in the top 100. We alreadly have an individual ranking system for that. In your system someone ranked 101 gets nothing, they are the same as someone ranked 800'000!!! You could have a guild with every member ranked between 101 and 200 and they would not feature in your rankings. You could then have a player ranked 30'000 with 27'000 fans and be in one of the top guilds!!!

There are plenty of other guilds that want to know where they are placed, its not all about the top 10. It was a nice try but currently the only way to measure the ranking of an entire guild is on fans.

For me a top player is one that can hold a high rank and keep max fans. Winning matches is one thing, defending them is more skillful as generally you won't be online when challenged and wont be able to use your subs. Therefore fans are important, they show defensive skill, if you keep losing them then you are not as good as you think.

Then you take the time to do it. And shut up with the fans. You like fans, it's a nice excuse for you to not try to show your quality. And let me correct what I said when asking for feedback earlier, I want both sides of feedback: problem and proposed solution. This should be tough, this should make people want to be in the top 100, what you say are flaws most see as strengths. Enjoy your fans and not testing yourself. Keeping fans is simple and there is no challenge to it, anyone can do it. Being ranked as high as you can be, there is the challenge


No i said a combination of retaining fans and indivdual rankings are important. I'm guessing your resistance to fans means you have trouble defending matches? I think you agree with me that a guild ranking should be based on a combination of all guild members, it just ruins your ranking system and you can't face that it might not be the best way of measuring the best guilds. You know i heard you could be overtly angry, seems to be true. Calm down, its just a discussion, im not trying to insult you.
Posted on 06/01/17 14:55.